General Category > A Valley Without Wind 1 & 2
JtP: I must be missing something.
Professor Paul1290:
These missions are supposed to be pretty hard and they're supposed to be hard. They're optional, you're not really required to do them.
They're probably not worth the resources, but I usually end up doing these because I like them believe it or not.
I like putting on a cloaking enchant of some kind then try to see if I can get through killing as few enemies as possible. :D
eRe4s3r:
I am sorry but this argumentation is wrong. Mission types are game CONTENT and not dynamic difficulty, that means each mission has to be player friendly and that means has to be FUN to play. If 3 hardcore player like the mission that makes 97 other gamers who hate it (I do too)
Also given that those 3 missions type represent like 40% of the entire mission content of the game, maybe instead of talking down the issue there should be put some effort into making these missions fun for a great many players, and not for very few players.
To start with, difficulty setting should influence mission difficulty. If a mission type is nearly impossible on "easy" then it's broken, and not a challenge or feature.
Bluddy:
--- Quote from: eRe4s3r on April 30, 2012, 10:33:16 AM ---I am sorry but this argumentation is wrong. Mission types are game CONTENT and not dynamic difficulty, that means each mission has to be player friendly and that means has to be FUN to play. If 3 hardcore player like the mission that makes 97 other gamers who hate it (I do too)
Also given that those 3 missions type represent like 40% of the entire mission content of the game, maybe instead of talking down the issue there should be put some effort into making these missions fun for a great many players, and not for very few players.
To start with, difficulty setting should influence mission difficulty. If a mission type is nearly impossible on "easy" then it's broken, and not a challenge or feature.
--- End quote ---
I agree. Suppose I invent a mission type: race against a ghost record of yourself. You beat the mission if you're fast enough to beat your previous record. Some people (perfectionists and masochists) will like this, but most will hate it. Why? Because it's boring and repetitive, and has no interesting goals.
Every mission is really a mini-game, and just like you try to make games dynamic and interesting and appeal to as many people as possible while retaining their challenge, you need to approach missions the same way. In my opinion, when a mission only appeals to a handful of people, it's missing its goal. Because a handful of people can always fill in the mission with their imagination and somehow make it work on some level, but a lot of people will like the mission only if the gameplay is solid and if it really has the right components that make it enjoyable to the human brain.
tigersfan:
--- Quote from: eRe4s3r on April 30, 2012, 10:33:16 AM ---I am sorry but this argumentation is wrong. Mission types are game CONTENT and not dynamic difficulty, that means each mission has to be player friendly and that means has to be FUN to play. If 3 hardcore player like the mission that makes 97 other gamers who hate it (I do too)
Also given that those 3 missions type represent like 40% of the entire mission content of the game, maybe instead of talking down the issue there should be put some effort into making these missions fun for a great many players, and not for very few players.
To start with, difficulty setting should influence mission difficulty. If a mission type is nearly impossible on "easy" then it's broken, and not a challenge or feature.
--- End quote ---
I completely disagree.
For starters, where did 40% come from? I just counted, there are at least 10 different mission types in the game currently so JtP can't possibly be 40% of the available mission types. Am I missing something?
That said, if we try to make every mission fun for all players, then we're going to end up with a whole bunch of missions that all look pretty much the same. Not all things are going to be fun for all players. Personally, I HATE the lava escape missions, they aren't fun for me, and no amount of tweaking or changing will make them fun. But, that doesn't mean Chris should try. They are fun for some, they are completely optional, so why worry?
If there is no way to make the mission fun for players like me, why should we take it away from players who DO find it fun?
keith.lamothe:
--- Quote from: tigersfan on April 30, 2012, 10:54:58 AM ---That said, if we try to make every mission fun for all players, then we're going to end up with a whole bunch of missions that all look pretty much the same.
--- End quote ---
That was my reaction as well. If we can't have missions that some (or even most, but not pushing it too far) players don't like, then meaningful gameplay variety goes out the window. Seriously, if that's a requirement, then we may as well stop adding mission types.
It is possible to help make it clearer to folks that they don't have to play missions they don't want to play, and we've done a bit of that already since 1.0. The change to how mission types are picked while seeding is particularly significant in that respect.
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