Does anyone use Spirecraft Shield Bearers?

[Wingflier]

The concept of these are great - huge, mobile shield that doesn't reduce fleet damage.

However, the "cannot be repaired" aspect kills it for me.

Sure, these are cheaper than most Spirecraft ships, but their one-time use (as a shield) seems like a dealbreaker. 

Does anyone use these?

Thanks.

[TechSY730]

I do.
I stock up on them as extra defense quite often. Also, unlike normal forcefields, they are immune to EMP, meaning that they can buy you precious time in the horrid case where an EMP guardian manages to sneak into you planets.
Also, they don't require supply, so they can defend things when deep striking. EDIT: And also add extra defense to shard recovery

I do think that they could use at least some sort of an HP buff to make up for their non-repairability, and also a minimum forcefield radius.

[Cyborg]

I use them. They are the inverse of the martyr. During a extremely tough assault, they can buy you enough time to do the necessary. Also, try putting raid starships under them during an assault on a tough planet. They do need more HP, but they're not useless.

[TechSY730]

About the Spirecraft HP thing,

5565: Spirecraft Shield Bearer HP

[Wingflier]

I don't understand why they don't auto-repair.

Immune to repair, auto-repair over like 15-30 minutes.  Then you still have to use them sparingly, but they aren't useless after one use.

[TechSY730]

I don't understand why they don't auto-repair.

Immune to repair, auto-repair over like 15-30 minutes.  Then you still have to use them sparingly, but they aren't useless after one use.

That was discussed previously (EDIT: in fact, I suggested it IIRC, but I said like 2-4 hours...), but the verdict was no because that would encourage people to just go to +10 speed and wait for the shields to heal up, thus largely defeating the point of what they were there for.

[Wingflier]

Okay but doesn't wasting game time like that having consequences of its own?

Look, if you're on such a low difficulty that you can continue fast forwarding the game in 2-4 hour increments after every big battle, then you don't need the shields to begin with.

If you can play AI War fast-forwarding the game that much, then your auto-progress is too low.  Doesn't seem like a problem to me.

[TechSY730]

Okay but doesn't wasting game time like that having consequences of its own?

Look, you're on such a low difficulty that you can continue fast forwarding the game in 2-4 hour increments after every big battle, then you don't need the shields to begin with.

If you can play AI War fast-forwarding the game that much, then your auto-progress is too low.  Doesn't seem like a problem to me.

I agree, but I'm not the one who made the call. 

[Wingflier]

In my view, if that's how people want to play the game - hell let them.  You don't balance the game for what people may do on difficulty 6 or less; why does it even matter how they win on those difficulties?  You could probably win on most of the lower difficulties without ever spending a point of knowledge (it would be time consuming but so would this +10 spire shield strategy); should we try to stop people from doing this?

I highly doubt, that on difficulty 9, people would be fast forwarding the game in 2 hour periods so that their Spire Shields could regen.

If you want to fix something that's too powerful on higher difficulties, you can start with the Botnet Golem.

No offense or any type of aggressiveness intended, just my 2 cents.

[Cyborg]

We have been trying to stamp out reasons to fast forward the game for quite awhile now. Let's go for a comprehensive solution without regressing to our old ways.

[keith.lamothe]

We have been trying to stamp out reasons to fast forward the game for quite awhile now.

This.

Even on 8+ people who play for maximum efficiency wind up having to wait on fleet rebuilds (I think the need for fleet rebuilds is fine, the time cost is part of the game, the problem is that the player often has nothing better to do than wait during that time).  Edit: actually, the waiting is far more common than just 8+ and maximum efficiency, that's just where it gets more noticeable iirc.  Netflix queues shouldn't have to be part of your AIW strategy.

If the shields regen'd during that time it would impact their balance significantly.

I do realize that it's psychologically difficult to deal with a completely unrepairable forcefield unit, but that's what makes them balanceable: the same thing that makes martyrs balanceable.  I wouldn't say martyrs are actually balanced, they're in the upper range of "OP but in a hilarious way", but they would be completely coocoo-for-cocoa-puffs if they weren't one-use and were repairable.

Using the spirecraft shield bearers for normal FF duty isn't a very good idea: in those roles you need sustainability.  The spirecraft ones are for critical situations where you don't need to get through the same challenge every 15 minutes, you need to get through this one.  Like the AI EMP'd your homeworld, or you're attacking an AI homeworld without supply, or you're trying to hold a wormhole against a particularly nasty exo-CPA-wave-hybrid combo, etc.

I'm quite happy to adjust their HP and/or asteroid costs further (and we could maybe laterally-think-up some extra things like protecting things under it from sniper, ion, tachyon, etc), but the one-shot nature of them is basically the defining characteristic of the unit, I've not been able to see any way around that.

[relmz32]

personally, I've used them since i got over my distaste for unrepairable things, and they do great things for saving your bacon (and the game).

 I usually have a bank of Siege Towers and high level Ion Blasters, and have lots of leftover low-mid tier asteroids, which turn into martyrs, shield bearers, and rams, depending on need. I also kind of liked that siprecraft medium and hard play very differently for me, as on medium you can't repair spirecraft anyways, so siege towers and ion blasters lose a lot of value, which makes you look for value in the non-repairable spirecraft.

I do think that they could use at least some sort of an HP buff to make up for their non-repairability, and also a minimum forcefield radius.

Seconded! At least, the minimum forcefield thing, if possible.

[Minotaar]

I'm up for a minimum radius as well. As of now if it's below 30% it's as good as scrap.

[LintMan]

Yes, at the very least they should have a good sized minimum radius.  Or perhaps not shrink at all.   For a disposable unit, they should remain useful for their entire lifespan instead of the first 2/3 of it.

I'd like to see them repairable in show way, though.  If not through a slow auto-repair (my preference), maybe just make them extremely expensive to repair? (ie: golem-level+ expensive)

[BobTheJanitor]

I'm with the no-shrinking camp. If they can't be repaired anyway, there's not really any reason for them to also slowly decrease in effectiveness over time, right? I also wish they would do something neat on death, like Martyrs, to make their death more of a neat event and less wasteful feeling. I don't know what would fit them though. Some kind of area defense buff that persists for a few minutes, or a ghost forcefield or something? Dunno.