Topics

1

AI War Strategy Discussion / Unbelievably hard starting position

« on: November 09, 2010, 09:11:06 AM »

Ok, found a starting pos. Really hard to survive it. My lifespan is about 18 minutes. The settings are the following.

Both Zenith and Neinzul expansions on.
2 diff 8 AIs, one Assassin, the other Tag Teamer.
All plots on.
All minor factions on.
Complex ship types.
Realistic hubs, 80 planets.
Seed: 935546875
Pick anti-armour planet.

My strategy so far has been trying to get Mark I fleet ships up. Hasn't been working so far. Keep getting owned by that hits around 14-15 minutes in.

If I figure out a way to survive I'll update this post.

Edit: Well first wave is easy to survive as long I use anything EXCEPT anti-armours. :/

2

AI War / Z polarizers don't make sense (aka tooltip LIES)

« on: November 09, 2010, 06:41:18 AM »

So yeh, story time!

I pick Z polarizers again, thinking they'd be fun and strong unit. Homeworld spawns next to a Mark IV planet... I think I can probably take it out extremely quickly. So start preparing. Then I get curious. I wonder, just how much damage does a Z Polarizer do? It says "attack * armour rating". Ok, so vs a mark IV bomber, it should be 7000 * 96... I check the reference thing in stats... That's weird, Mark IV bombers BEAT them. Something ain't right. So I send one to an enemy planet, pause right as it arrives, and start checking the damage values. Turns out the "armour rating" is rather arbitrary. My findings.

Note: Armour rating = actual damage / 96 (damage of mark II Z polarizer). Armour value = displayed armour in the ship's tooltip. With AV/AR, lower = better.

Ship Name	'armour rating'	armour value	AV/AR
Fighter	20	200	10
Frigate	24	300	12.5
Zenith Bombardment Ship	24	300	12.5
Bomber	44	1000	22.72
Spec ops post	88	2000	22.72
Wormhole gaurdpost	2	0	DIV/0
Warp gate	62	1000	16.12
Orbital Command Station	76	1500	19.73
Siege Starship Mark III	28	200	7.14
AI Missile Gaurd Post	56	800	14.28

No pattern at all. They barley kill bombers faster then frigates (27 hits vs 30, 1000 armor vs 300). What I assumed would be the armor rating isn't the armor rating at all.

Conclusion: Tooltip needs to be fixed to match the ship, or the ship needs to be fixed to match the tooltip. I'd prefer the latter.

PS. Wasn't sure if I should put this in bug reports.

3

AI War / Frustration with units ignoring exo-shields.

« on: September 24, 2009, 05:15:18 PM »

This is the second game it's happened. It's very frustrating. I feel there's nothing I could do. If anyone has any suggestions, please share.

Basically I'm playing Realistic Hubs 80 planets against 2 Diff 8s, one Rand Harder, one Rand Moderate. Playing with these settings, means I often get large waves that completely wipe out my wormhole defenses, so I'm often left with none. This means units that can ignore force-fields slip past. These then take out at least one harvester which I can do nothing to stop. In both games they managed to take out 2-3 harvs, and well, they just rushed me, and the amount of ships they attacked with combined with my crippled economy (no harvs) meant death.

First game was against a Shadow Master (moderate one) and Spec ops. This meant infiltrators and lots of units coming into my system. By the time I realised what was happening, I was down 5-6 harvesters and I was dying, with no economy to stop it. This is simply because the infils bypass the exo-shields, ruining my economy in a fraction of the time the other units would. This happened around the 40 minute mark.

The second game was similar. I kept getting hit by large waves, lots of parasites and stuff that fighters counter. I didn't have tech for fighters 2 (silly me), but in the end I don't think it'd have helped. At the crunch, around the 1h20m mark (just killed an extra planet... so many waves), I got hit by a "168 unit cross planet attack" that turned out to be 1,200+ ships (bug?). A few of them were eye bots and vamps. About 2 minutes into the attack, I had absolutely no harvesters. They were all dead. All the attacking units were stuff like parasites and raiders - nothing that can kill exo-shields quickly - with a few ignore shield units, which were maybe %1 of the force. Due to my simple lack of economy I lost any chance of surviving. I had no resources to produce fighters with to counter the massive amount of raiders and cruisers. My slim chance got obliterated to nothing.

I think exo-shields should block all units personally. Up the ongoing cost by 50% (or even double it), it'd be worth it.

Also, I wasn't sure to put this in the Suggestion forum or not, so move it if you wish.

PS: The second game, AI were mad bomber and unknown. Never found out, gave up when I had nothing to fight with and a 1000 ships pelting at my home station.

4

AI War Technical Support / [Solved] Sound not found

« on: September 20, 2009, 06:59:07 AM »

9/20/2009 9:57:39 PM (1.999A)
-----------------------------------Application_ThreadException-----------------------------------System.Exception: Could not find sound 'ShotMissileA'
   at AIWar.GameForm.PlaySound(String Filename, SoundType Type) in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\GameFormParts\Startup.cs:line 2057
   at AIWar.ForegroundObject.FireAtObject(ForegroundObject ObjectToFireAt, Int32 OffsetAmount, FInt OffsetAngle) in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\Framework\ForegroundObject.cs:line 7408
   at AIWar.ForegroundObject.TryAttack(Boolean CanSearchForNewTargets) in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\Framework\ForegroundObject.cs:line 6855
   at AIWar.GameForm.RunNextCycle(Boolean DoRendering, Boolean DoScrollingAndInput) in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\GameFormParts\GameLoop.cs:line 1060
   at AIWar.GameForm.gameLoop() in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\GameFormParts\GameLoop.cs:line 220
   at AIWar.GameForm.GameForm_Load(Object sender, EventArgs e) in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\GameFormParts\Startup.cs:line 252
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.OnLoad(EventArgs e)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.OnCreateControl()
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.CreateControl(Boolean fIgnoreVisible)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.CreateControl()
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmShowWindow(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.ScrollableControl.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.ContainerControl.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.WmShowWindow(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)

Self explanatory?

5

AI War / Nerf infiltrators.

« on: September 16, 2009, 02:32:37 AM »

Ok, this is basically a "I just got owned so lets post a nerf thread" post. I still think it's valid tho.

Basically infiltrators ignore force-fields, AND they do kickass damage against em. I decided to go ingame and check. 8000 per hit against force fields (and turrets) for Mark I. Their base damage is 40. That's a 200x multiplier.

So, a little math. Mark III force-field has 56,000,000 hp. Infils Mark I do 8000 damage every 1.5 seconds with a cap of 475 to them. 56,000,000 / (8000/1.5 * 475) = 19.64. Just under 20 seconds.

Heh, infiltrators are better at killing force-fields and defense then bombers are.

Why is their ability to kill force-fields a problem? Because then your home station (or w/e else is under it) becomes vulnerable to anything else on the planet, such as bombers, and recently nerfed starships.

6

Off Topic / Captain Forever (game).

« on: September 09, 2009, 09:37:00 PM »

Warning: Incoming mini-review.

Basically a top down shoot em up, made in flash. Catch is, you build your ship from salvaged parts you get by destroying enemies. Also has a neat feature where you can save your ships. :]

                             
                             
          |   |   |         
      v   +   +   +   v     
    ------- /---\ -------   
    |      =| @ |=      |   
    ------- |---| -------   
      ^   ^   ^   ^   ^     
                             
                             
                             
Pilot this vessel

HTML, Plain Text and email are also supported.

The game itself is a pre-release you can get access to for $15. The current ver is going to go free later, with a better ver for payed customers. Price also goes up to $20 at that time.

It's pretty fun. Very hard to make a Kilo ship (best class parts in the game), which is what's keeping me playing atm. I'd recommend you hold out until the future version comes to buy it, or if you're feeling adventurous (or are just have tons of money), go ahead and buy it. :]

And now, links!

http://www.captainforever.com/
http://www.farbs.org/?p=137
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1IQBR6cyrs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3NlZV9mCn0

7

AI War / Cutlass Balance

« on: September 09, 2009, 06:08:10 PM »

Yep, starting a thread about cutlasses, when used in the hands of a human player. My question is this:

Are they useful?

I find they aren't. They aren't good at anything. They kill themselves trying to kill turrets because turrets have too much hp. There's so many other units that can kill home stations and warp gates better then them. They're too slow to be useful against military units. They can get past shields, but this is rarely useful, and not worth an entire unit. Other units can do it to, and better (eye bots, infiltrators).

I think cutlasses simply need a damage buff, mostly to offset how much damage they take when attacking, and also because just about every other unit in the game can outrun them.

Edit: Yes, I am aware they are very powerful in the hands of the AI. In the hands of a player though, they are a terrible unit.

Edit2: This now just a general cutlass balance thread. :]

8

AI War Technical Support / Crash in lobby 1.202D

« on: September 06, 2009, 11:25:28 AM »

Ok, I think this happened when someone tried to join. I may have been alt-tabbed.

-----------------------------------Application_ThreadException-----------------------------------System.ArgumentException: An item with the same key has already been added.
   at System.ThrowHelper.ThrowArgumentException(ExceptionResource resource)
   at System.Collections.Generic.Dictionary`2.Insert(TKey key, TValue value, Boolean add)
   at System.Collections.Generic.Dictionary`2.Add(TKey key, TValue value)
   at Lidgren.Network.NetServer.AddConnection(Double now, NetConnection conn) in C:\vcother\lidgren-network\2009-7-07\lidgren-network\Lidgren.Network\NetServer.cs:line 329
   at Lidgren.Network.NetConnection.Approve(Byte[] localHailData) in C:\vcother\lidgren-network\2009-7-07\lidgren-network\Lidgren.Network\NetConnection.Approval.cs:line 36
   at Lidgren.Network.NetConnection.Approve() in C:\vcother\lidgren-network\2009-7-07\lidgren-network\Lidgren.Network\NetConnection.Approval.cs:line 14
   at AIWar.NetworkServerWrapper.CheckServer() in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\DX\NetworkServerWrapper.cs:line 147
   at AIWar.GameForm.RunNextCycle(Boolean DoRendering, Boolean DoScrollingAndInput) in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\GameFormParts\GameLoop.cs:line 535
   at AIWar.GameForm.gameLoop() in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\GameFormParts\GameLoop.cs:line 220
   at AIWar.GameForm.GameForm_Load(Object sender, EventArgs e) in C:\vcprojs\AIWar\GameFormParts\Startup.cs:line 253
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.OnLoad(EventArgs e)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.OnCreateControl()
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.CreateControl(Boolean fIgnoreVisible)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.CreateControl()
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmShowWindow(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.ScrollableControl.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.ContainerControl.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.WmShowWindow(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Form.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)

9

AI War / Differences in AI Levels

« on: September 04, 2009, 09:49:38 AM »

Ok this has been bothering me for a while...

x4000, think you could share what the difference between each AI level is, in tactics and wave sizes and such.

10

AI War / The Impossible Challenge

« on: August 25, 2009, 06:18:27 PM »

I was going to call this the "Ultimate Challenge", but I think realised that's an understatement.

Ok, so, basically do this solo or with a team, doesn't matter, you're going to lose horribly and painfully have loads of fun.

So, what is this challenge? Simple, see how long you can survive with the following settings, then post your time and stories here.

Map: Anything, doesn't matter, you're going to lose have fun anyway.
 
Ship Tab:
Available ships: Complex
All boxes checked.

Game Options Tab:
Combat Style: Your choice.
AI Modifier: 2x enemy waves.
Visibility: Extra Fog of War
Auto AI Progress: 250 every 5 minutes.

Make the AIs both Difficulty 10 Scorched Earths, with 300% handicaps.

Now, go lose have fun!

11

AI War / I've figured it out! (homeworlds, where they are).

« on: August 25, 2009, 03:19:44 AM »

They're always as far away as possible! I realised this as I noticed the homeworlds are both TWENTY ONE hops away. Sweet jebus.

12

AI War / The new power plants.

« on: August 24, 2009, 07:25:43 PM »

I thought it'd be best to start a thread about the new changes to power in general (plants using up res constantly, and increased power costs), since obviously these are going to affect more then one patch.

So, things I've noticed so far.

- Engis are actually worth something now, at a hefty 4000 power. I no longer just spam them because I can. This is the same with stuff like docks, power gens, and pretty much everything in general.
- I actually built a mobile repair station. I already have 12 tugs. With only 2 engis (yes, I only have TWO), I need something else to repair my fleet, so a MBR does it.
- Starships are going take a long time to build now, due to the above mentioned lack of engis.
- Instead of having my dock on a constant loop, and being out of resources because I'm spamming to reach caps, I'm now picking exact amounts of units to build.

So far I think I'm loving the changes.

PS. Another side effect is that's it's best to not build extra docks, but extra engis, so you have at least 2 engis per dock (or starship dock), as far as speed and power go.

13

AI War / Power plants and resource drain (1.014V)

« on: August 24, 2009, 01:55:14 AM »

Ok, I did some math, now that powerplants drain resources. Should give some insight.

The following values are energy per -1 metal and crystal per second. So, 4000 means you're getting 4000 power for -1m/ps and -1c/ps. The higher they are, the better. Also, the lowest value for each Mark is just repeated for any new power plants.

#	Mark I	Mark II	Mark III
1	2500	2666	2000
2	2000	1600	400
3	1500	533	200
4	1000	266	" "
5	500	" "	" "
6	250	" "	" "

This basically means you the perfect build for plants on a planet is 2,1,3/1,3/1,2,1,1,2,1,3 and then just spam 2s if you need any extra. Ideally you'd never do that and just build 3 I, 2 IIs and a III. This gives you 156,000 power for -61r/s (2557 ratio).

This also raises the point that Mark IIIs are no longer the most inefficient resource wise, but Mark Is are. The initial resource cost quickly becomes secondary. No longer true as amounts were revised.

Edit: Values have been revised for 1.014U.

14

AI War / Cross planet attacks still broken?

« on: August 23, 2009, 03:15:32 AM »

http://willhostforfood.com/access.php?fileid=80948

Ok, 2 saves there. First one (shorter name) is 1 minute before a cross-planet attack is supposed to come. Second one is 8 minutes later (I think, maybe longer) and still no attack (although I did make a nice spy network  ). I think they sent like 30 ships and gave up or something. Anyway, there's like 1500 Mark III ships sitting on one of their planets right next to mine, doing nothing. The "Threat" level also says 1500, but they still haven't attacked.

Kinda sad when I set up 1000 fleet ship defense with 600 mines and 5 Force fields and they never come.

15

AI War / This AI is awesome.

« on: August 22, 2009, 11:05:27 PM »

This is a thread about how awesome the AI is. Lets share stories about it here. I'll start.

Alright, I'm playing a game with PhonSiE. I'm assaulting the AI's planet, got a beach head set up, taken out the gate/comm station and I'm bringing in a colony ship. I start building my comm station, all is going well. Then I notice 2 Mark III Force Fields coming my way.

I laugh. I'm thinking "What are 2 puny force fields gonna do?". Boy was I wrong.

So, the force-fields slowly make their way to my comm station. I have no where near enough forces to kill them. Now, get this. They drive over my Comm Station... AND THEN THEY BRING IN ATTACKING UNITS. I was like "OMFG". The AI provided a shield for it's small amount of units (only like 6!) to kill my comm station. I was flabbergasted. Not only that, but they were blocking the wormhole, so I couldn't even retreat!

THEN while I was trying to get out, IT SENT A WAVE AT MY HOME STATION. I can't remember, but I think it may have even killed it.

This AI is just amazing.